In-My-Opinion.org

»911 was staged - PROOF«






Good call, there, Wonderboy. Bring in PM's hit piece, and let's go over it point by point. This debate goes on everywhere on the web, and has now even come mainstream to C-SPAN 2 BookTV, with author David Ray Griffin's televised 1.5 hr. speech, which aired these last two Sats.



posted by escapetheMatrix
  

in-my-opinion.org -> Religion and Mysteries, from worship to werewolves -> Conspiracy theories -> 911 was staged - PROOF



escapetheMatrix:
Don't know what you're getting at with the word "ADDITIONAL". Are you implying that there were bombs onboard the passenger airliners? I'd like to see some proof of that, seriously.

No, I mean that there were additional bombs and not only the planes.
escapetheMatrix:
Dude, why the hard-on for the jet fuel? What do you think it's really gonna do? Melt steel?

I just rewatched a TV documetary on that topic that I have recorded. No, the steal itself did NOT melt. But the horizontal "aligners" (I think this is meant by "perimeter columns" in your post) collapsed, which held the vertical steel columns in place and which were much thinner than the massive vertical steel. Thus the building did not collapse because the molten steel, but because of instability of the softened horizontal alingers.

Actually the destabilized part was only small (approx where the planes hit), but once it started to collapse and hit on the lower WTC levels you couldn't stop it.

And, ahem, I am sorry, who is Kevion Ryan from "Environmental Health Laboratories"? What does environmental health have to do with building experts and fire experts and ingeneering experts?

Oh, I see, he works for the company that certified the steel? Well, no wonder then that he has to fight that bad PR against his company. This guy is as biased as you can get.

Sorry, I'd rather trust the experts.

I still have the report, it's rather big to put it online, but it makes more sense than the "WTC has been brought down by bombs" conspiracy.


posted by knn

How hot does fuel burn?



I always presumed that engine fuels burned at relatively low temperatures.

Ok hot for toasting Marshmallows, but cool compared to how they make steel.

After all who wants to heat their engine to several hundred degrees to get the car started on a morning? White laugh

But then I've never really given it that much thought I learned something new, I guess

posted by Marl64
  



Marl64:
but since we haven't had any conspiracies for a while...

I made a subject about the conspiracy of the pentagon strike but i don't think anyone checked it out. That was a conspiracy.


posted by Lexx
  



I have recently gotten into this stuff about 9/11 and have seen a lot of films about it, and there are a lot of things that don't add up. The best film I've seen is Loose Change Second Edition (LC2E) Download here:


The things that bug me the most are:

That I have not seen a single picture of a plane at the Pentagon (where there is probably cameras everywhere.) They released five frames that show an explosion, but no plane. The explanation is that the plane burned up, leaving almost no trace. And there is no damage after the wings or the engines in the wall:







I can't remember exactly when, but a plane was on its way to Athens Greece and crashed fullspeed into a mountain wall. It was on fire but did not burn up, and there where wingsections, engines, cockpit, bodies etc.

That apparently some of the hijackers have turned up alive, and could therefore not have been on the planes:


That you can see what definatly look like explosions below the demolition wave:



That fire can apparently throw steelbeams hundreds of feet:


That the FBI claimed to find a passport from one of the hijackers, while 7 of the 8 black boxes where allegedly destroyed. So a passport can fly through the fireball at the WTC without burning up, but the black boxes can't take it?

That the towers fell down in about 10 seconds, nearly at freefall speed, and the tower that was hit dead on, and had been burning for about 20 minutes longer than the other, falls last.

That WTC 7 later falls down in about 5 seconds in perfect demolition style without having been hit by an airplane.

That Bush finds out about the attack and just sits there lika a retarded muppet doing nothing, and he doesen't look shocked at all, just nervous.

That NORAD did not send up fighter jets in time, that a bunch of arabs could outsmart the entire american defense system.

That the hijackers where nice enough to allow passengers to make calls to their families or whatever, and a strange call where someone calls his mom saying: Hi mom, this is Mark Bingham. I don't think I have ever called my mom and used my full name.

That Larry Silverstein bought the entire WTC complex and took out a special insurance against terrorist attacks a few weeks before 9/11.

That will do for now, I'm going for a smoke, I'll post more weirdo shit about 9/11 later, by the way, what are your opinions about this stuff? I have to say that I think the official explanation as to what happened on 9/11 seems to be full of holes so big that a Boeing 757 could fly through them. Peace.







EDIT:


*Strange how the roofline collapses so evenly, I guess, that all the central core columns and all the perimeter wall columns collapsed simultaneously. Some coincidence eh?*

*Once again, note that the second layer of explosions is much more powerful than the first and that the dust cloud from the first initially obscures that of the second. Also, note the large orange areas of hot gas from the explosions. Recall, that this was about two hours after the aircraft struck the building, so there would be essentially no flammable material left on the floors from which the flash emanates (as the fire would have already consumed it all).*


posted by seraphim
  



I think it was all staged, when it happened i watched a documentry on it, it showed a timeline, there was a gaping hole in the timeline which they filled with "slowing down the planes?" Why, if it was real not staged, would they slow down?

posted by Deeindamatrix
  



seraphim:
That fire can apparently throw steelbeams hundreds of feet:

I'm sure people can be convinced with the other photos, but this one i quoted above, c'mon! that's clearly when the building was colapsing, which could, you guessed it, throw steelbeams hundreds of feet Silly and stupid, that's how I feel


posted by The ONEder Man
  I know where you live. I will send a rape commando -- knn



Deeindamatrix:
I think it was all staged

It probably was. It seems no one wants to talk about this besides you 2 so, meh...


posted by seraphim
  



seraphim:
It probably was.

yeah because that's the most rational reason I can think of... Silly and stupid, that's how I feel


posted by The ONEder Man
  



The ONEder Man:
seraphim:
It probably was.

yeah because that's the most rational reason I can think of... Silly and stupid, that's how I feel

Well think about this: No damage from the wings or the engines in the Pentagon wall from the Boeing 757 that supposedly smashed into it.

No pictures of a Boeing at the Pentagon.

The hijacker that supposedly flew the Pentagon plane was a sucky pilot and controlled the plane in such a way that all the people in the controltower thought that it was a military plane.

Some of the hijackers still alive.

People hearing explosions in the towers before the collapse.

Explosions bursting from the buildings several stories below the demolition wave.

No response from NORAD, 4 hijacked planes can wonder around in the air for about 90 minutes without fighter jets being deployed, which is what usually happens when a plane looses contact with the controltower.

WTC 7 falls to the ground without being hit by a plane in perfect demolitionstyle in 5 seconds.

Larry Silverstein took out a big insurance specifically against terrorist attacks after buying the entire WTC complex just weeks before the attacks and him saying on tv that they decided to pull building 7, pull being a demolition term, and he said that they decided to demolish the building a few hours after the attack, which is impossible since it takes weeks of planning to bring down a building in the way that WTC 7 was brought down.

Both WTC towers coming down, also in perfect demolitionstyle in about 10 seconds, about 10 floors per second, and all the steelbeams severed into perfect sections just right for the trucks that removed them before they could be examined.

No pictures of flight 93 after it supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania, people working at Cleveland Hopkins airport saying that flight 93 landed there and therefore did not crash.

That is something to think about, now I'm going to sleep, goodnight.


posted by seraphim
  



seraphim:
Well think about this: No damage from the wings or the engines in the Pentagon wall from the Boeing 757 that supposedly smashed into it.

CLAIM: Two holes were visible in the Pentagon immediately after the attack: a 75-ft.-wide entry hole in the building's exterior wall, and a 16-ft.-wide hole in Ring C, the Pentagon's middle ring. Conspiracy theorists claim both holes are far too small to have been made by a Boeing 757. "How does a plane 125 ft. wide and 155 ft. long fit into a hole which is only 16 ft. across?" asks reopen911.org, a Web site "dedicated to discovering the bottom line truth to what really occurred on September 11, 2001."

The truth is of even less importance to French author Thierry Meyssan, whose baseless assertions are fodder for even mainstream European and Middle Eastern media. In his book The Big Lie, Meyssan concludes that the Pentagon was struck by a satellite-guided missile--part of an elaborate U.S. military coup. "This attack," he writes, "could only be committed by United States military personnel against other U.S. military personnel."

FACT: When American Airlines Flight 77 hit the Pentagon's exterior wall, Ring E, it created a hole approximately 75 ft. wide, according to the ASCE Pentagon Building Performance Report. The exterior facade collapsed about 20 minutes after impact, but ASCE based its measurements of the original hole on the number of first-floor support columns that were destroyed or damaged. Computer simulations confirmed the findings.

Why wasn't the hole as wide as a 757's 124-ft.-10-in. wingspan? A crashing jet doesn't punch a cartoon-like outline of itself into a reinforced concrete building, says ASCE team member Mete Sozen, a professor of structural engineering at Purdue University. In this case, one wing hit the ground; the other was sheared off by the force of the impact with the Pentagon's load-bearing columns, explains Sozen, who specializes in the behavior of concrete buildings. What was left of the plane flowed into the structure in a state closer to a liquid than a solid mass. "If you expected the entire wing to cut into the building," Sozen tells PM, "it didn't happen."

The tidy hole in Ring C was 12 ft. wide--not 16 ft. ASCE concludes it was made by the jet's landing gear, not by the fuselage.


seraphim:
No pictures of a Boeing at the Pentagon.

CLAIM: Conspiracy theorists insist there was no plane wreckage at the Pentagon. "In reality, a Boeing 757 was never found," claims pentagonstrike.co.uk, which asks the question, "What hit the Pentagon on 9/11?"

FACT: Blast expert Allyn E. Kilsheimer was the first structural engineer to arrive at the Pentagon after the crash and helped coordinate the emergency response. "It was absolutely a plane, and I'll tell you why," says Kilsheimer, CEO of KCE Structural Engineers PC, Washington, D.C. "I saw the marks of the plane wing on the face of the building. I picked up parts of the plane with the airline markings on them. I held in my hand the tail section of the plane, and I found the black box." Kilsheimer's eyewitness account is backed up by photos of plane wreckage inside and outside the building. Kilsheimer adds: "I held parts of uniforms from crew members in my hands, including body parts. Okay?"


seraphim:
The hijacker that supposedly flew the Pentagon plane was a sucky pilot and controlled the plane in such a way that all the people in the controltower thought that it was a military plane.

the control tower people actually said this? or is it just on a conspiracy website that they said that?
seraphim:
Some of the hijackers still alive.

really?
seraphim:
People hearing explosions in the towers before the collapse.

i wonder what it sounds like when a plane slams into a building?
seraphim:
Explosions bursting from the buildings several stories below the demolition wave.

CLAIM: The first hijacked plane crashed through the 94th to the 98th floors of the World Trade Center's 110-story North Tower; the second jet slammed into the 78th to the 84th floors of the 110-story South Tower. The impact and ensuing fires disrupted elevator service in both buildings. Plus, the lobbies of both buildings were visibly damaged before the towers collapsed. "There is NO WAY the impact of the jet caused such widespread damage 80 stories below," claims a posting on the San Diego Independent Media Center Web site (sandiego.indymedia.org). "It is OBVIOUS and irrefutable that OTHER EXPLOSIVES (... such as concussion bombs) HAD ALREADY BEEN DETONATED in the lower levels of tower one at the same time as the plane crash."

FACT: Following up on a May 2002 preliminary report by the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), a major study will be released in spring 2005 by the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST), a branch of the U.S. Department of Commerce. NIST shared its initial findings with PM and made its lead researcher available to our team of reporters.

The NIST investigation revealed that plane debris sliced through the utility shafts at the North Tower's core, creating a conduit for burning jet fuel--and fiery destruction throughout the building. "It's very hard to document where the fuel went," says Forman Williams, a NIST adviser and a combustion expert, "but if it's atomized and combustible and gets to an ignition source, it'll go off."

Burning fuel traveling down the elevator shafts would have disrupted the elevator systems and caused extensive damage to the lobbies. NIST heard first-person testimony that "some elevators slammed right down" to the ground floor. "The doors cracked open on the lobby floor and flames came out and people died," says James Quintiere, an engineering professor at the University of Maryland and a NIST adviser. A similar observation was made in the French documentary "9/11," by Jules and Gedeon Naudet. As Jules Naudet entered the North Tower lobby, minutes after the first aircraft struck, he saw victims on fire, a scene he found too horrific to film.


seraphim:
No response from NORAD, 4 hijacked planes can wonder around in the air for about 90 minutes without fighter jets being deployed, which is what usually happens when a plane looses contact with the controltower.

CLAIM: No fighter jets were scrambled from any of the 28 Air Force bases within close range of the four hijacked flights. "On 11 September Andrews had two squadrons of fighter jets with the job of protecting the skies over Washington D.C.," says the Web site emperors-clothes.com. "They failed to do their job." "There is only one explanation for this," writes Mark R. Elsis of StandDown.net. "Our Air Force was ordered to Stand Down on 9/11."

FACT: On 9/11 there were only 14 fighter jets on alert in the contiguous 48 states. No computer network or alarm automatically alerted the North American Air Defense Command (NORAD) of missing planes. "They [civilian Air Traffic Control, or ATC] had to pick up the phone and literally dial us," says Maj. Douglas Martin, public affairs officer for NORAD. Boston Center, one of 22 Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) regional ATC facilities, called NORAD's Northeast Air Defense Sector (NEADS) three times: at 8:37 am EST to inform NEADS that Flight 11 was hijacked; at 9:21 am to inform the agency, mistakenly, that Flight 11 was headed for Washington (the plane had hit the North Tower 35 minutes earlier); and at 9:41 am to (erroneously) identify Delta Air Lines Flight 1989 from Boston as a possible hijacking. The New York ATC called NEADS at 9:03 am to report that United Flight 175 had been hijacked--the same time the plane slammed into the South Tower. Within minutes of that first call from Boston Center, NEADS scrambled two F-15s from Otis Air Force Base in Falmouth, Mass., and three F-16s from Langley Air National Guard Base in Hampton, Va. None of the fighters got anywhere near the pirated planes.

Why couldn't ATC find the hijacked flights? When the hijackers turned off the planes' transponders, which broadcast identifying signals, ATC had to search 4500 identical radar blips crisscrossing some of the country's busiest air corridors. And NORAD's sophisticated radar? It ringed the continent, looking outward for threats, not inward. "It was like a doughnut," Martin says. "There was no coverage in the middle." Pre-9/11, flights originating in the States were not seen as threats and NORAD wasn't prepared to track them.

...

CLAIM: "It has been standard operating procedures for decades to immediately intercept off-course planes that do not respond to communications from air traffic controllers," says the Web site oilempire.us. "When the Air Force 'scrambles' a fighter plane to intercept, they usually reach the plane in question in minutes."

FACT: In the decade before 9/11, NORAD intercepted only one civilian plane over North America: golfer Payne Stewart's Learjet, in October 1999. With passengers and crew unconscious from cabin decompression, the plane lost radio contact but remained in transponder contact until it crashed. Even so, it took an F-16 1 hour and 22 minutes to reach the stricken jet. Rules in effect back then, and on 9/11, prohibited supersonic flight on intercepts. Prior to 9/11, all other NORAD interceptions were limited to offshore Air Defense Identification Zones (ADIZ). "Until 9/11 there was no domestic ADIZ," FAA spokesman Bill Schumann tells PM. After 9/11, NORAD and the FAA increased cooperation, setting up hotlines between ATCs and NORAD command centers, according to officials from both agencies. NORAD has also increased its fighter coverage and has installed radar to monitor airspace over the continent.


seraphim:
WTC 7 falls to the ground without being hit by a plane in perfect demolitionstyle in 5 seconds.

Larry Silverstein took out a big insurance specifically against terrorist attacks after buying the entire WTC complex just weeks before the attacks and him saying on tv that they decided to pull building 7, pull being a demolition term, and he said that they decided to demolish the building a few hours after the attack, which is impossible since it takes weeks of planning to bring down a building in the way that WTC 7 was brought down.

CLAIM: Seven hours after the two towers fell, the 47-story WTC 7 collapsed. According to 911review.org: "The video clearly shows that it was not a collapse subsequent to a fire, but rather a controlled demolition: amongst the Internet investigators, the jury is in on this one."

FACT: Many conspiracy theorists point to FEMA's preliminary report, which said there was relatively light damage to WTC 7 prior to its collapse. With the benefit of more time and resources, NIST researchers now support the working hypothesis that WTC 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than the FEMA report indicated. "The most important thing we found was that there was, in fact, physical damage to the south face of building 7," NIST's Sunder tells PM. "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom--approximately 10 stories--about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out." NIST also discovered previously undocumented damage to WTC 7's upper stories and its southwest corner.

NIST investigators believe a combination of intense fire and severe structural damage contributed to the collapse, though assigning the exact proportion requires more research. But NIST's analysis suggests the fall of WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse.

According to NIST, there was one primary reason for the building's failure: In an unusual design, the columns near the visible kinks were carrying exceptionally large loads, roughly 2000 sq. ft. of floor area for each floor. "What our preliminary analysis has shown is that if you take out just one column on one of the lower floors," Sunder notes, "it could cause a vertical progression of collapse so that the entire section comes down."

There are two other possible contributing factors still under investigation: First, trusses on the fifth and seventh floors were designed to transfer loads from one set of columns to another. With columns on the south face apparently damaged, high stresses would likely have been communicated to columns on the building's other faces, thereby exceeding their load-bearing capacities.

Second, a fifth-floor fire burned for up to 7 hours. "There was no firefighting in WTC 7," Sunder says. Investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel that many tenants used to run emergency generators. Most tanks throughout the building were fairly small, but a generator on the fifth floor was connected to a large tank in the basement via a pressurized line. Says Sunder: "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."

WTC 7 might have withstood the physical damage it received, or the fire that burned for hours, but those combined factors--along with the building's unusual construction--were enough to set off the chain-reaction collapse.


seraphim:
Both WTC towers coming down, also in perfect demolitionstyle in about 10 seconds, about 10 floors per second, and all the steelbeams severed into perfect sections just right for the trucks that removed them before they could be examined.

CLAIM: As each tower collapsed, clearly visible puffs of dust and debris were ejected from the sides of the buildings. An advertisement in The New York Times for the book Painful Questions: An Analysis Of The September 11th Attack made this claim: "The concrete clouds shooting out of the buildings are not possible from a mere collapse. They do occur from explosions." Numerous conspiracy theorists cite Van Romero, an explosives expert and vice president of the New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology, who was quoted on 9/11 by the Albuquerque Journal as saying "there were some explosive devices inside the buildings that caused the towers to collapse." The article continues, "Romero said the collapse of the structures resembled those of controlled implosions used to demolish old structures."

FACT: Once each tower began to collapse, the weight of all the floors above the collapsed zone bore down with pulverizing force on the highest intact floor. Unable to absorb the massive energy, that floor would fail, transmitting the forces to the floor below, allowing the collapse to progress downward through the building in a chain reaction. Engineers call the process "pancaking," and it does not require an explosion to begin, according to David Biggs, a structural engineer at Ryan-Biggs Associates and a member of the American Society of Civil Engineers (ASCE) team that worked on the FEMA report.

Like all office buildings, the WTC towers contained a huge volume of air. As they pancaked, all that air--along with the concrete and other debris pulverized by the force of the collapse--was ejected with enormous energy. "When you have a significant portion of a floor collapsing, it's going to shoot air and concrete dust out the window," NIST lead investigator Shyam Sunder tells PM. Those clouds of dust may create the impression of a controlled demolition, Sunder adds, "but it is the floor pancaking that leads to that perception."

Demolition expert Romero regrets that his comments to the Albuquerque Journal became fodder for conspiracy theorists. "I was misquoted in saying that I thought it was explosives that brought down the building," he tells PM. "I only said that that's what it looked like."

Romero, who agrees with the scientific conclusion that fire triggered the collapses, demanded a retraction from the Journal. It was printed Sept. 22, 2001. "I felt like my scientific reputation was on the line." But emperors-clothes.com saw something else: "The paymaster of Romero's research institute is the Pentagon. Directly or indirectly, pressure was brought to bear, forcing Romero to retract his original statement." Romero responds: "Conspiracy theorists came out saying that the government got to me. That is the farthest thing from the truth. This has been an albatross around my neck for three years."


seraphim:
No pictures of flight 93 after it supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania, people working at Cleveland Hopkins airport saying that flight 93 landed there and therefore did not crash.

"flight 93 crash"

did anyone care to read that popular mechanics article that was posted in this thread at all? or since it didn't deal with adding to any conspiracies didn't waste time on it?


posted by allone
  all you really need is 88mph. that's when the flux compacitor starts to work.

US and al Qaeda Collusion Through Mind Control


What if CIA/NSA/FBI/etc. have mind control rays and used them to link to the 9/11 hijackers' minds, and then the feds guided the planes into the buildings through mind control to make sure the US had an excuse to go to war against al Qaeda and eventually Iraq?

That way, both the US government and al Qaeda were behind the attacks! Everybody happy?

(BTW the mind control rays could also explain the suspiscious circumstances of the Princess Diana crash, like the fact that she died with her Arab boyfriend, the car hit the thirteenth pillar, etc., and probably if American CIA have mind control rays then so do the British MI5 . And as I've said before, the CIA et al were probably also behind the JFK assassination, but they used an explosive implant surgically inserted into Kennedy's head, which was triggered by Oswald's gunshots.)

The nation that controls the human mind controls the world! Down with MindFreedom International! MindSlavery is the way of the future!


posted by MindSlavery Florida
  

What are you saying?



allone:
seraphim:
No pictures of flight 93 after it supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania, people working at Cleveland Hopkins airport saying that flight 93 landed there and therefore did not crash.

"flight 93 crash"

Dunno what the the googling was supposed to reveal, but all I got were pictures of a crash SITE

including;
Nena Lensbouer, who had prepared lunch for the workers at the scrap yard overlooking the crash site, was the first person to go up to the smoking crater.
Lensbouer told AFP that the hole was five to six feet deep and smaller than the 24-foot trailer in her front yard. She described hearing “an explosion, like an atomic bomb”—not a crash.
Lensbouer called 911 and stayed on the line as she ran across the reclaimed land of the former strip mine to within 15 feet of the smoking crater.
Lensbouer told AFP that she did not see any evidence of a plane then or at any time during the excavation at the site, an effort that reportedly recovered 95 percent of the plane and 10 percent of the human remains.


Which might have been mentioned before.


posted by Marl64
  

Re: What are you saying?



Marl64:
allone:
seraphim:
No pictures of flight 93 after it supposedly crashed in Pennsylvania, people working at Cleveland Hopkins airport saying that flight 93 landed there and therefore did not crash.

"flight 93 crash"

Dunno what the the googling was supposed to reveal, but all I got were pictures of a crash SITE

yeah, pictures of the flight 93 crash site. did you expect to see a perfectly intact plane sitting in the field?

[when the shuttle crashed debri was scattered for hundreds of miles...(i know its not the same exact situation but people can argue that it wasnt the shuttle that crash landed since it was never seen ...it must have been a missile or something)]


posted by allone
  

Re: What are you saying?



Nena Lensbouer, who had prepared lunch for the workers at the scrap yard overlooking the crash site, was the first person to go up to the smoking crater.
Lensbouer told AFP that the hole was five to six feet deep and smaller than the 24-foot trailer in her front yard. She described hearing “an explosion, like an atomic bomb”—not a crash.
Lensbouer called 911 and stayed on the line as she ran across the reclaimed land of the former strip mine to within 15 feet of the smoking crater.
Lensbouer told AFP that she did not see any evidence of a plane then or at any time during the excavation at the site, an effort that reportedly recovered 95 percent of the plane and 10 percent of the human remains.


so, pretty much a woman heard a loud boom then saw a crater...im guessing she didn't see the crash take place since she didn't say, "i saw a missile crash into the ground" or "i saw a plane crash into the ground", so she heard the crash, then saw the impact site...and? did she see the engine that was found some 300 yards away from the crater?

she also didn't see any evidence of a plane during the excavation...was she part of the excavation efforts? was she anywhere near it? do they allow civilians who are not part of the excavation/investigation anywhere near a crash site like that while they are excavating/investigating it? (when the shuttle crashed here i saw pieces of metal, but that metal didn't resemble a space shuttle...so it must have been something else)

again, what would it sound like when a something large like a plane slams into the ground or a building? i think it would sound like an explosion...i really loud boom maybe? (i think its funny though...she describes hearing an explosion like an atom bomb...i wonder if she has ever even heard an atom bomb go off other than in a movie?) (also, again with the shuttle crash, the morning that happened i was woken up to an enormous explosion type sound, my apartment windows rattled for a good 10 second and car alarms were going off everywhere, i thought it was a bomb that went off...so again, it must have been some type of missile since nobody ever actually saw the shuttle crash, just pieces of metal and there was a really loud explosion...like an atom bomb)

and there was debri, again, it wasnt all in one area but was scattered about, think about it...youve got a plane traveling how fast?

(ever seen a high speed car wreck? its not the same exact thing since a car cannot reach speeds that a plane can and they stay on the land, but in a high speed car wreck do you have depri in one place, or is it scattered all over the place? my friend back in high school was in a bad car wreck, he ran into a tree, there was debri up to 30yards away from the tree he hit, and also debri about 40ft up in the tree. the people who lived on the street that it happened on didn't see it take place, but described hearing something like an explosion)
Roving Engine
CLAIM: One of Flight 93's engines was found "at a considerable distance from the crash site," according to Lyle Szupinka, a state police officer on the scene who was quoted in the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review. Offering no evidence, a posting on Rense.com claimed: "The main body of the engine ... was found miles away from the main wreckage site with damage comparable to that which a heat-seeking missile would do to an airliner."

FACT: Experts on the scene tell PM that a fan from one of the engines was recovered in a catchment basin, downhill from the crash site. Jeff Reinbold, the National Park Service representative responsible for the Flight 93 National Memorial, confirms the direction and distance from the crash site to the basin: just over 300 yards south, which means the fan landed in the direction the jet was traveling. "It's not unusual for an engine to move or tumble across the ground," says Michael K. Hynes, an airline accident expert who investigated the crash of TWA Flight 800 out of New York City in 1996. "When you have very high velocities, 500 mph or more," Hynes says, "you are talking about 700 to 800 ft. per second. For something to hit the ground with that kind of energy, it would only take a few seconds to bounce up and travel 300 yards." Numerous crash analysts contacted by PM concur.


Indian Lake
CLAIM: "Residents and workers at businesses outside Shanksville, Somerset County, reported discovering clothing, books, papers and what appeared to be human remains," states a Pittsburgh Post-Gazette article dated Sept. 13, 2001. "Others reported what appeared to be crash debris floating in Indian Lake, nearly 6 miles from the immediate crash scene." Commenting on reports that Indian Lake residents collected debris, Think AndAsk.com speculates: "On Sept. 10, 2001, a strong cold front pushed through the area, and behind it--winds blew northerly. Since Flight 93 crashed west-southwest of Indian Lake, it was impossible for debris to fly perpendicular to wind direction. ... The FBI lied." And the significance of widespread debris? Theorists claim the plane was breaking up before it crashed. TheForbiddenKnowledge.com states bluntly: "Without a doubt, Flight 93 was shot down."

FACT: Wallace Miller, Somerset County coroner, tells PM no body parts were found in Indian Lake. Human remains were confined to a 70-acre area directly surrounding the crash site. Paper and tiny scraps of sheetmetal, however, did land in the lake. "Very light debris will fly into the air, because of the concussion," says former National Transportation Safety Board investigator Matthew McCormick. Indian Lake is less than 1.5 miles southeast of the impact crater--not 6 miles--easily within range of debris blasted skyward by the heat of the explosion from the crash. And the wind that day was northwesterly, at 9 to 12 mph, which means it was blowing from the northwest--toward Indian Lake.




posted by allone
  



Goto page Previous  
1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

Reply to topic
Goto page Previous  
1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next






RegisterRegister
Log inLog in
The time now is 1 December 2008, 22:27
php B.B.