»Are Good and Evil just human concepts? Or universal laws?«
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 knn: Exactly. Just think of 9/11.
There is cause and effect. And there is OPINION (= good, evil, shame, failure...) about the cause and about the effect. ok lets look at another example...rape is there any case in which rape would be considered good? the only thing i can think of is if a man and a woman are the only 2 people left on earth and one is not putting out 
seriously though if good and evil are opinions where do these opinions stem from? in our core self? so without our environment and genetics there would be no baring on morality? are the only reason things are considered good is that they support the continuation of life? so are death and cancer evil? posted by The ONEder Man |
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| in-my-opinion.orgReligion and Mysteries, from worship to werewolvesReligious & Philosophical TopicsAre Good and Evil just human concepts? Or universal laws? |
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The responses so far hint at an inclination or endorsement of relativism. Moral relativism depends on the argument that because moral disagreement is intractible, then there are no objective facts. Howeover, objectivity does not guarantee agreement, and vice versa. If relativism were true, then someone could claim that the world is flat, and it would be true for him since he believes it. This is false. The argument from the relativst could then be: empericism cannot be applied to moral facts. This depends on the following premise: emperical evidence guarantees objectivity. This is false: Math is not emperical, and yet it is regarded as true. A relativist would argue that if someone believed two was an odd number, it would be true for him. Sorry folks, two is not an odd number. What other means do we have to argue that moral truth is relative? I cannot think of any. If, on the other hand, one is arguing there are no moral truths, then one is in fact being a skeptic, not a relativist. posted by dub329 |
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 dub329: If relativism were true, then someone could claim that the world is flat, and it would be true for him since he believes it. This is false. ...because he disbelieves himself. FIRST you have to believe that you can trust your senses and your logic. If you see from evidence/senses that the world is round BUT THEN say to yourself that it's flat then it's not even true for himself. This explains the contradiction in your statement: "it would be true for him since he believes it" doesn't apply. Thus you cannot use your argument against relativism, since you are not talking about relativism but about self-deception a la "Blue is red because I say so" posted by knn |
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Quote: dub329:If relativism were true, then someone could claim that the world is flat, and it would be true for him since he believes it. This is false.
...because he disbelieves himself. My comment states "he believes it". Your argument assumes he is just saying the world is flat, but in this example, his belief in the idea makes the idea true for him from a relativist standpoint. Similarly, my belief that the world is round is true but is not true for someone else if he doesn't believe me. Relativism would also contend that if somone believes that two is an odd number, it is true for him. There are plenty of examples I can use, but I would probably just be repeating myself. posted by dub329 |
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dub329: his belief in the idea makes the idea true for him from a relativist standpoint. No, it doesn't. It causes a contradiction, not a truth. He simply denies a formerly accepted truth. dub329: Relativism would also contend that if somone believes that two is an odd number, it is true for him. Another contradiction. Another enforced statement. Not truth. Not even for him. posted by knn |
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Yes, just because he believes it doesn't make it true. I guess you believe relativism is false then? posted by dub329 |
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dub329: Yes, just because he believes it doesn't make it true. No, I meant, because he believes it doesn't make it true FOR HIM either. dub329: I guess you believe relativism is false then? I only rarely give out my opinion in this forum. As an admin I reserve the right to post posts that don't relate to my opinion. posted by knn |
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Quote: No, I meant, because he believes it doesn't make it true FOR HIM either. Ohh, perhaps you are referring to the moral skeptic standpoint, that there are no moral truths. I don't think I know enough about moral skepticism to comment at this time. 
posted by dub329 |
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knn: allone: the difference between good and evil simply depends on your point of view. Exactly. Just think of 9/11. There is cause and effect. And there is OPINION (= good, evil, shame, failure...) about the cause and about the effect. I LIKE TO THINK, and still mostly find that MOST people go out into the world every day with the intent to be as good a person as they can. For the most part, I think that those who hesitate in deciding what good and bad/right and wrong are seem to be the ones who are only interested in themselves. posted by eck |
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The time now is 12 February 2012, 20:58 php B.B. |