»Gitmo Detainee 063's Life with the Banana Rats«
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This week's Time magazine contains excerpts and descriptions of a classified interrogation log of a young Saudi prisoner at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. He is believed to have been sent to the US to help hijack the 9/11 aircraft, is apparently the famed "20th hijacker," and was captured in Afghanistan, after which he was identified by fingerprints taken when he tried unsuccessfully to enter the US. I found this excerpt particularly disturbing: "11 December 2002 0100: Detainee was reminded that no one loved, cared, or remembered him. He was reminded that he was less than human and that animals had more freedom and love than he does. He was taken outside to see a family of banana rats. The banana rats were moving around freely, playing, eating, showing concern for one another. Detainee was compared to the family of banana rats and reinforced that they had more love, freedom, and concern than he had. Detainee began to cry during this comparison." This is by definition a dehumanizing tactic. This is a young man who will very likely remain imprisoned for the rest of his life. He may give them the information they need, and I guess that's the point, but I think this Time article may spell the beginning of the end for the Guantanamo Bay prison. I would post more excerpts, but I don't want to discourage people from reading the article on Time's website (registration and fee required) or buying the magazine. I think it's the most significant piece of evidence detailing American torture policies yet produced, including the Abu Ghraib photos. Those may have been just a bunch of morons running amok, but this article details a systematic policy of psychological and physical torture, of which the psychological kind sounds worse to me. What must be going through his mind? You may not care, but as someone who has been locked up before (institutionalized), I can say from personal experience that it is hell on Earth. And in the public hospital I was in, they didn't do anything close to what this Detainee 063 experienced. I wish someone would achieve regime change in America and shut down Gitmo for good. posted by holy_of_holies |
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| in-my-opinion.orgPoliticsPolitics and Crime (Assorted topics)Gitmo Detainee 063's Life with the Banana Rats |
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I really feel that if you have committed offenses against a government and it's people and this can be proven without a shadow of a doubt then you get what you deserve when it comes to torture and "hell" you are put thru. This is not the kind of torture our men in Korea, Japan, China, or Germany went through. These men were doing there duty in most cases and were told they were war criminals by the enemy when it was not true and they were inhumanly tortured. What we have done to these "actual" criminals is pussy foot around compared to what would be done to them anywhere else they are probably glad they are in the hands of Americans rather than be in the hands of any other country where they would be hung by there fingernails or there balls upside down in a dark black box in the middle of a searing desert. They should consider themselves lucky we don't send them to some other country where there would be no objections to them being tortured inhumanly. posted by Runamokamerican |
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Runamokamerican: I really feel that if you have committed offenses against a government and it's people and this can be proven without a shadow of a doubt then you get what you deserve when it comes to torture and "hell" you are put thru. In the case of Detainee 063, he has never been tried on the terrorism charge, so it has not been proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. And remember that the US Constitution forbids cruel and unusual punishment before you start advocating torture. Runamokamerican: This is not the kind of torture our men in Korea, Japan, China, or Germany went through. These men were doing there duty in most cases and were told they were war criminals by the enemy when it was not true and they were inhumanly tortured. I notice you conveniently left out Vietnam. Weren't they tortured in Vietnam as well, Runamok? Or were they war criminals there? Help me out here... Runamokamerican: What we have done to these "actual" criminals is pussy foot around compared to what would be done to them anywhere else they are probably glad they are in the hands of Americans rather than be in the hands of any other country where they would be hung by there fingernails or there balls upside down in a dark black box in the middle of a searing desert. They should consider themselves lucky we don't send them to some other country where there would be no objections to them being tortured inhumanly. But, once again - I hope I'm not boring you - I must point out that that would be against the law. Funny how "patriots" seem so willing to discard the legal protections that are the foundation of our society in exchange for the new fascism of the radical right. posted by holy_of_holies |
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 holy_of_holies : Funny how "patriots" seem so willing to discard the legal protections that are the foundation of our society in exchange for the new fascism of the radical right. funny how the liberal left and yourself seem to forget what real torture is. Sad to see the media reports this instead of the extreme cases of iraq and al qaeda. Sad to see you have jumped on the bandwagon and see these minuscule events as the real wrong doing. This pales in comparison. runamokamerican is right runamokamerican: What we have done to these "actual" criminals is pussy foot around compared to what would be done to them anywhere else they are probably glad they are in the hands of Americans rather than be in the hands of any other country where they would be hung by there fingernails or there balls upside down in a dark black box in the middle of a searing desert. They should consider themselves lucky we don't send them to some other country where there would be no objections to them being tortured inhumanly. Since you seem to be blind to this I guess I'll have to shock you back into your senses, seems to be the only viable way. So, a video the media deemed too distasteful to be shown, and rightfully so, it is REAL torture. Well I digress...most of the videos i could find wer not torture, but out right beheadings. **viewer discretion is advised**   Now please tell me again...how being compared to banana rats is bad when comapred to this type of slaughter? 
posted by The ONEder Man |
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holy_of_holies: I found this excerpt particularly disturbing: you apparently don't know disturbing posted by The ONEder Man |
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The ONEder Man: holy_of_holies: I found this excerpt particularly disturbing: you apparently don't know disturbing Your idea of disturbing is Mine is brainwashing, ala Gitmo. I would much rather be physically tortured illegally than psychologically tortured legally. So it's subjective. PS: I didn't watch your videos. posted by holy_of_holies |
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holy_of_holies: I would much rather be physically tortured illegally than psychologically tortured legally. So it's subjective. hmmm I would hope that you were not in the majority, but who knows, i'm sure some people would rather lose a hand or 2 than be compared to a banana rat 
posted by The ONEder Man |
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The ONEder Man: holy_of_holies: I would much rather be physically tortured illegally than psychologically tortured legally. So it's subjective. hmmm I would hope that you were not in the majority, but who knows, i'm sure some people would rather lose a hand or 2 than be compared to a banana rat You must not have read the full article. There's more to it than the banana rat issue. A letter written by an FBI counterterrorism official to the Pentagon reveals that Detainee 063 was "subjected to intense isolation for over three months," and that he was "evidencing behavior consistent with extreme psychological trauma (talking to non existent people, reporting hearing voices, crouching in a cell covered with a sheet for hours on end.)" I'm not a psychiatrist, but I would hazard a guess that he is experiencing psychotic symptoms. In case you have never had them, psychotic symptoms are more painful than any physical pain a person can experience. People often assume that mental illness is painless, but that is just wrong. So essentially what you have, IMO, is a mentally ill detainee who has 1) never been convicted of a crime; 2) been subjected to psychological torture; and 3) will remain imprisoned without possibility of release for the rest of his natural life. "20 December 2002...Began teaching the detainee lessons such as stay, come, and bark to elevate his status up to that of a dog." posted by holy_of_holies |
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Female interrogators inappropriately touched detainees, including rubbing perfume on one and massaging another's back. Investigators documented that a woman in one case smeared what she described as menstrual blood -- it was fake -- on a prisoner, but they recommended no further action on the allegation because it happened some time ago.
Interrogators threatened one high-value prisoner by saying they would go after his family. This was in violation of U.S. military law, the investigation found. Military interrogators impersonated FBI and State Department agents. This practice was stopped after the FBI complained. Interrogators improperly used duct tape on a detainee. An FBI agent said a prisoner was bound on the head with duct tape, his mouth covered, because he was chanting verses from the Quran. Interrogators used cold, heat, loud music and sleep deprivation on prisoners to break their will to resist interrogation. These techniques were approved at certain times at Guantanamo. Chaining a detainee to the floor in a fetal position was not authorized; however, the investigation could not confirm an FBI agent's allegation that detainees were left in this position for long periods. posted by holy_of_holies |
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 So I guess, which is worse? Psychological torture, with relative physical discomforts, or abusive physical torture? Either way, we're (USA) definitely pushing the envelope. Maybe too far. Does the end justify the means? posted by sangu |
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 sangu: So I guess, which is worse?
Psychological torture, with relative physical discomforts, or abusive physical torture? no beheadings or brutal death choice as i pointed out earlier? hmm since my choice has been omitted, this is a toughie 
posted by The ONEder Man |
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But as I pointed out to Runamok, your argument is specious because we are a lawful society and thus are bound by the rule of the law. posted by holy_of_holies |
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The ONEder Man: no beheadings or brutal death choice Oops. Add the beheadings. I assume they torture before they behead as well, to get information, so oneder man would win the 'what torture is worse' argument. 1. Are you sure there isn't some sort of law that allows that kind of torture? After 911, I won't be surprised to find out there is a law allowing certain acts under the umbrella of attacking terrorism. 2. Even though it's against the constitution, are the terrorists, oh I mean "terrorists", still protected by the constitution? Just a question. posted by sangu |
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The time now is 24 May 2012, 08:28 php B.B. |